Aspire for More with Erin
Aspire for More with Erin
Lets Talk about Leads and Call Centers with Danny Leonhardt
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Innovations in Senior Living Lead Management with Danny Linhart
In this episode of the 'Aspire for More with Erin' podcast, Erin interviews Danny Linhart, CEO of Lead Genie, a company focusing on contact center and lead management solutions in the senior living industry.
Danny shares his extensive background in senior care, including his previous roles in hospice care and experiences at 'A Place for Mom'. The conversation delves into the evolution of lead management over the past two decades, contrasting traditional methods like print directories with digital solutions and discussing how COVID-19 transformed lead sourcing.
Danny emphasizes the importance of nurturing potential leads and the role of advisory services in helping families make informed decisions about senior living options. He also explains the value of Lead Genie's call center in supporting sales directors with managing inquiries efficiently. The discussion provides insight into how technology and human empathy intertwine in the senior care industry, ensuring families make the best decisions for their loved ones.
00:00 Welcome and Introduction
00:10 Meet Danny Linhart: CEO of Lead Genie
00:24 Exploring Lead Genie
00:58 Danny's Journey in Senior Living
03:57 Founding Care Changes
05:22 The Evolution of Lead Management
06:50 Impact of COVID on Lead Generation
09:17 The Role of Advisors in Senior Living
18:10 Challenges and Solutions in Senior Living Sales
20:36 The Importance of Call Centers
27:05 Remote Sales Director Services
32:04 Database Management and Nurturing Leads
35:31 Conclusion and Final Thoughts
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Thank you for coming back and listening to another episode of the aspire for more with Aaron podcast. I truly am very grateful for your time today. And I have an amazing guest. His name is Danny Linhart and he is the CEO of lead Jeannie and a new friend. Thank you. Danny. Thank you for being here. I appreciate it.
Danny:Yeah, I'm glad to be here with you. Glad to know you too.
Erin:Yes. So tell me about Lead Genie.
Danny:Lead Genie. I should
Erin:rub on a bottle or something.
Danny:we do, every time we mention the name, everyone smiles and everyone, every time I say it, I still smile when I say our genies, which are our, our agents, our advocates, our associate, for the, for our calls. So Lead Genie is a, a contact center and lead management solution. for the senior living industry, and that includes the communities as well as senior living services, senior care services. and so we, we call again, our, our counselors are called Jeannie. So that's, it's a cute thing.
Erin:Yes, it is and we're going to dive in. You have a very diverse background inside senior living. Hospice is a passion of yours. You worked for a place for mom, which we can certainly spend an hour there. You started your own business, and now you and you had lots of adventures there and now you're in. CEO world of working with lead Jeannie call centers and dedicated sales directors. For communities, so we're going to really take a deep dive into the history of leads and your intimate relationship with leads and to really just educate ourselves on that. So I'm excited so tell us how it all began, because your story is a fascinating story.
Danny:I, and I don't want to eat up your time, and many people have heard it. So I'm sure they're bored with it. But, the, the, It for me, I'm gonna get through the parts that led because I feel like the universe always leads you where you need to be. And it has really done that for me for most of my life and my career. And for me, I did graduate work in clinical psychology, which then I eventually found my path with a friend into working for ABC Radio, which I got to do a morning show Monday through Friday with a country station in Atlanta, which that was what I called my fun work. But the trade off was they gave me a health reporter show or a public service show on the weekends. And so I got to, host that show and in that I got all these great guests and one of them was in the space of hospice, which led to a career in hospice eventually, which then led to a friend of mine, whom was probably the 3rd, pardon me, the 4th or 5th advisor to the show. at a place for mom. And this would have been those early 2000 years. And she was like, you really should come join us over here. And I'm like, you're crazy. I don't know why I would do something like that. The industry had never seen anything like it, especially in the Southeast. cause I'm based in Atlanta, Georgia and, the, but I kept talking to her and eventually I spoke to the founders of a place for mom, Pam and John. And, and that conversation continued on, but once I got through all of the vetting. I eventually was like, I think I could do this and do it well. And I really did see where it belonged in this space of senior living. and I'd also saw where it was going to be a game changer. And it really was for how we, went about sourcing leads, managing leads and, and assisting the industry with occupancy and so forth. So I saw the opportunity even then 20 years ago, and I also really liked the business model. Yeah. And in doing so, I had a successful run of multiple years at APFM. Then, I went through some life changes that were major for me with my mom and dad, that led me to want to go back to hospice. But then I went there for a minute and realized I was not done with the, referral placement space that I had left with APFM. And I decided then to found my own company called Care Changes, and that was in January of 2006. And I, that was the pivotal part of my life that defines, I think, my career, to this point. And that was a time when, most leads were sourced via local professionals, and then some were sourced through the internet. It was not what it is today. and so I think for someone like me, I bring a perspective of what it's been like over the last 20 years of sourcing leads. And then also what it's like for the families themselves through this journey. I think all of that has changed considerably. And I think we have to look back at a lot of this. I know I do and think about what worked and then where we are and what's probably coming next for us. And, So back to the AP, pardon me, to the care changes, creation of my company, it was very slow. It was very challenging. There wasn't a lot of competition. APFM obviously was the competitor then, and there weren't a lot of other folks in the space, not at a national level. I spent the first couple of years setting it up, just getting things behind the scenes set up for operations. I recruited my sister over to this industry to be someone I could trust and someone that would work really hard with me to build and grow the company. we did just that. And we also lived through all these different, phases or iterations of leads. I like to mention that part too. There was around 2009, 2010, there was a phase there where everyone was like, oh, we're getting away from referral placement fees, pay performance. We're going to go to pay per lead, right? That was a big thing. Let's just charge 25 or 35 a lead. I never jumped into that, but I watched it closely. I start, I talked to my colleagues and finding out, is that something that the, they felt that was a real value? And is that where the industry should go? And And I felt like that had a shelf life that lasted a few years, but it never really stuck around. At least again, my opinion. I never saw it as a great opportunity for the, I didn't see it right for either side of the business. So I stayed true to the pay performance model and I'm glad I did. and then we lived through other phases of things. We lived through the crash of a way that changed things considerably for all of us watching how we navigated the space. families were making alternative arrangements, just keep their loved ones at home. They were, I remember this, in fact, being a thing where, I would see a spouse who maybe would leave their job or had to leave their job and they would become the caregiver of the parent to be able to all one another subsidized finances. And that was a big thing that happened during that phase of history. And it could happen again. But hopefully we, we're not going to go back to that. But living through that and surviving through that again. being able to look back at what that was like, I think it was really helpful to what we've also lived through, which again, getting up to COVID. That was a whole nother thing for all of us, To get through that. And then it continued to, how do we source leads? I think that's when the internet was big. It was huge for APFM. It was huge for caring and care changes, but it really changed with COVID. I think that's when leads, we all relied on the internet for a family searching. And for us, I always say this too. I think our value became so great during that period as placement services, referral services, unlike it had ever been before, at least in my time, I'd never seen anything like it, right? Because the sales directors couldn't physically go out and market in their communities and do outreach. and so there was a great need to have folks like us sourcing leads for the communities. That was also a phase when I started, work partnering. I had a large partnership on a national level that was sourcing leads for me that eventually brought private equity into my life. And I ended up selling my company. And in doing so, that was the formation of a company called silver assist, which is an operation today that includes multiple brands, elder life, financial services, care changes, Oasis, senior advisors, And aid and attendance dot com, along with the family assets dot com website, all of that form silver assist, which is again, still in operation today. I stayed on a couple of years to help continue to run care changes. We had a very successful run. And in that time, I've got. As a founder, I have left that organization, took a little time, saw all my friends, and then I landed here at Lead Genie with a dear friend of mine named Debbie Howard, whom had founded this company. And I, was able to combine, I think, all my experience and my efforts with that past life into a place that, with Debbie. And to. Go in and come in and run this company. and we are a lead management solution. So we don't source the leads for our clients. We manage those leads for our clients. We answer the phones in a way because Debbie always says, her marketing agency, they generate the leads, but someone needs to answer the calls properly. And they also need to answer them in a speed to call timeframe. it's important because I feel like all those roads led to this and I think that's what a lot of people in senior living industry have found themselves, that their path just takes them where they need to be
Erin:when we allow it. Right when we allow the flow of life to take you where you need to be. it's a much smoother ride. So now we know that you are an expert.
Danny:I don't know about that.
Erin:You know how to source them and now you're managing them. So you're pretty high up there. I think Malcolm Gladwell gives you the expert term. If you have 10, 000 hours, I believe you have that, that's really only 3 years. you've got a lifetime of experience, so I'm going to deem you as an expert and as a community level leader, sometimes. I had major frustrations with people like a place for mom, or, all these other types of things. And I never really. understood why families would choose to go the path of an advisor role versus just calling a community. can you explain. Based on your experience. Why do they do this intentionally? Is it accidentally? Is it both? that a family would go that route a 3rd party route versus a direct phone call to a community and have a conversation.
Danny:Yeah, you and I talked about this before, 20 years ago, folks turned to the yellow pages. They turned to print directories. Like I said, at the grocery stores. that is really how I think people found senior living or they found it through their community, right? Their doctors, their churches, their friends, their neighbors. I think that the journey now is very different. But when it comes to a third party service, often called aggregators in the industry, whether it be a, a web based, internet based company, similar to a place for momcaring. com care changes, or if you're a local advisory service, like a Care Patrol or an Oasis, or you have your own local agency, I think all of them serve families very well. They have their space. They have their place in this. In my opinion, obviously, I'm a big believer in it. but I also understand where the value lies and it's very similar to what it was 24 years ago is what it is today with the value, which is that, families Often benefit from having an, an experienced or expert advisor to talk through their various different options that best meet their needs. And that includes their budgets, which money is obviously a big deal for everyone in this space. It's not cheap to access private paid senior living. So talking through that and finding options that truly will fit with what that family's able to afford is critical. Discussing through what type of care they need now and will likely need later is very important to have choosing the right community for that family. Again, short term, long term. I say this all the time. No one really understands the differences or the types of assisted living, stand alone memory care, independent living, CCRC, until you need it. You don't really sit around often discussing these things until it's impacted your life in some way. so having someone on the other line that can talk you through just simply what those different things mean and what they can mean to your family, I think is really valuable. rather than trying, maybe if you're calling a community directly, And having that conversation and they may not be able to meet your needs. Most of us in this business have good hearts and we like helping folks, even if we can't help them with what we have to offer, but it is really a great time saver for families and it's a great education for them. to speak to someone that can talk them through all those different options. And then really finding out about, I always say, location is important. The geography of things, because it's important to know where family lies and what community they want to be a part of. and that includes in large metropolitan areas where there may be are so many options, and traffic is an issue and medical services are an issue or, and choosing a community. It's less disruptive to those things. or if you're in a rural community, which I think is where advisory services really shine and people don't often think that, but I think we do because, rural communities don't often have, but one or two options in a town and not, and maybe one of those options doesn't work for the needs of that family, like secured memory care. And it just doesn't exist there. One thing I've always found too is that in rural communities, they found their ways around that to still be able to allow residents to age in place. And they've done that through locked doors or through wonder guards, and they've done what they've had to do to keep those residents in their side, their community and close to their loved ones. So that's an interesting thing that, again, it may not look like on paper, they offer memory care, but they're probably doing memory care work inside that building, right? If you're in a small town. There's also, the value of, An advisor being able to say, hey, I know you're familiar with your community, but are you familiar with the community, 15 miles away, or 20 miles away? There actually lies the assisted living or a newer assisted living or whatever meets their needs. and I would say this to people in rural communities are very comfortable driving 1520 miles typically versus what that looks like in a metro area. That's where an advisor can open doors and conversations, and have those resources available that can expand a family search. So again, I think it, that's just a few ways I think we benefit families, but there's such value in that. Again, it was 24 years ago, it still is. Same thing today, speaking to an advisor, but you ask the question. I just wanna make sure I point out, which is do they know where they've landed or how they've reached them? Most consumers don't often understand that they've reached an advisory service, but I think in many instances, most are glad they did. Now, I know the industry is always dealing with this and rightfully so making sure that the consumer has choice that the consumer, is able to say whom is going to help them and that their information is theirs, that they own their information. But at the same time, I do think that in most cases, it is a value for a family to have an advisor introduced into their lives that is experienced, that is knowledgeable, that can talk through all those things just mentioned. I think that's great value. And the best part of that typically with most models is it's no cost to the family. I'm still a big advocate of that. for that. Because I think that the industry provides that to the families with the way that the model is set up and it's lasted for a really long time because there is a lot to it. You know what I mean? a lot of other things have come and gone in this industry in my time and that one has stayed. So there's real value to it. So finding its place and managing how it sits inside the industry to me is a necessary thing.
Erin:Yeah, and like you said, it hasn't changed and everything else is changing. And I think this is just a valid point in general with senior living, some people will say that we're not as technology savvy. We have a lot to grow in that area. that's probably true and it doesn't matter how technology, grown we get. Nothing is going to take away the fact that we are dealing with. Families who are in some of the most critical times of their family's lives and there is a plethora of emotions going on and there is not a technology or an app or anything that can replace genuinely caring for what the next step is for this loved one. whether that comes from an advisor, whether that comes from the community. we can push the limits with technology, but nothing will take away caring and saying, maybe we're not the best place for you. Here's why and let me help you find the next best place. And the same thing goes for you saying to a family member. You can only do your best and your best is yours. It's not mine. And it's not, Jim's down the street. So your job is to recognize that your best isn't good enough anymore. And now you find the next best thing. That's what we are. That's what we're called to do as parents and as children and. As anybody's guardian, taking care of somebody who's in a very vulnerable position, and that's really what advisors do. And that's why it hasn't changed. And if we're not careful, and we give our sales directors too much too many tasks to do inside the community, they lose that ability to be that advisor to the families,
Danny:Very much. Yeah.
Erin:And I guess that's where, your current work comes in. I, I have never worked with a call center. and I, if somebody were to say to me, or come to me and say. We're going to take all of your calls and, let the call center answer the first one. As the executive director who could have had control issues. I'm just saying, why would I have somebody else take my calls when they could not be as empathetic as me or give people advice the way that I can like, why do I want to give a call center? My calls that I will be judged on my occupancy. How, why would I relinquish control? Please help me understand.
Danny:Yeah, absolutely. it, the word call center means so many things because we're all so used to it now, right? It doesn't matter what you call it, if it's your bank, if it's your cable, if it's really just almost anything has that sort of, sitting in the middle between or it's recordings about directions of one, two, three, right? Your pharmacy and so forth. But what is important is that, as you mentioned, With that family who's made that decision that I've reached my place here at perhaps it's caregiving. Perhaps it's just, all kinds of other factors or safety and I'm going to pick up the phone and make this call to finally have this conversation. It's really important that goes well, and that is what's going to keep that family continuing to think about that transition into senior living. I think a lot of us, a friend of mine in the business said this, so I can't take credit, but she said a lot of us are looking for signs and signals in the universe to maybe tell us that, it's not the time. perhaps you tried to call and it goes to voicemail. Perhaps you call on your, they get put on hold and that's just a signal that, you know what, I can delay this a little longer. Maybe I should wait because it's not something people really get that excited about doing or making this move for their loved one or for their spouse or maybe even themselves. So it's a big decision, I think, to pick up that phone and make that call, no matter how you find your way. To that phone number, whether it's through the search on the internet, an advisor gave you a list or someone, is calling you outbound to you to have this conversation. It catches you at the right time that you want to talk about it. So very important where we come in Lee Jeannie and where we pride ourselves on what we're here to do for our clients. And really for the families is to make sure that conversation is a great experience for that family. And that is making sure again, to your point. Times are different now for sales directors. It's not what it was before. And, again, most families came in either walking in the door as a drive by. They came in through, existing resident referrals. They maybe came through a Yellow Pages phone call. But not like it is today. Now we have our websites, our form fills where leads families are inquiring directly through the website of the community. The chat bot is unlike anything it ever was before. And so now there's these, virtual chats occurring that then lead to people actually scheduling tours through the chat. and that's coming to the sales director and ending up inside of her. CRM and inside of her calendar and planning her day for her and her week. In fact, the aggregators as mentioned are scheduling, sending over referrals and scheduling tours again at that same journey for that sales director. So now that's being put into their calendar. So the experience and then we can go on and on. And so the experience of being a sales director. From what I remember in the old days of going in communities constantly and being always being able to watch a sales director be a part of the community that included existing residents. he or she was always such a part of that. And, and then being able to have the time to. Tour the families and do them do that at the pace that's comfortable for the family and to really be relationship focused again, whether it's an existing resident or new resident or their extended families and then never mind the fact that we used to most of us do outreach. that's almost unheard of anymore that a sales director gets to go out into the community and be a part of the community. so you put all that together. And then you think about how is this sales director going to be able to answer the calls in a way that is part of just the fact, which is you have to get these calls when they come in. You have to answer them. Speed to answer is a really important part. Of what's happening now, because the consumers different, they're moving quickly. Now they come in well educated, they come in very informed and they often come in ready to do their own discovery. They're asking questions. They come in with all kinds of knowledge and information that they never did before. They often just follow the lead of what the sales director shared. But now they're coming in and just going down the questions with the sales director. So how does that person have time? To appropriately manage that conversation that then leads to a scheduled tour for them to show up and then be able to successfully tour them. I think it's a lot for sales folks. And I think most would agree that there's just so much coming at them all day long and where this stands up and sits nicely with them is we're there to support them. And that is our job. Our efforts are there to support the sales director and the front desk, which often gets overlooked, and it is the command center, the traffic control center of the whole building. And that includes mostly the telephone and those walking in. And so there's, we've all been through it where you try to call a community for whatever reason. And the sales department, the concierge or front desk is she's overwhelmed. And rightfully so she's got things happening in front, things happening behind, and she's got that phone and she might have someone on hold again, back to that universe. Maybe that caller is really getting losing interest at this point, or looking for signs that this isn't the right time to have this conversation. So the way to really avoid that is to have a service support like this that will be able to answer that call. Have the time, patience, answer when it needs to be answered, and have that healthy, relaxed conversation around welcoming that family, on behalf of that community, because we act as a welcome center for that specific community, and we are well informed with our knowledge of that community, so our genie can have a very successful phone call with that family that then leads to the next steps of scheduling the tour, Handing them off to the sales director in a way that sets the sales director up for real success with that family. And we also work out of their CRM. So being able to work inside the same record is very helpful to the sales director. So any of the notes or activities or text messaging or email we send, or multiple phone call attempts that we make, all of that is documented inside there so that the sales director can view it and they can pick up where we've left off if we're working it for one day. Or if we're working at over a three day workflow and then handing off to the sales director. So it's a real collaboration. I hope that's the message there that we're sitting and supporting that sales director.
Erin:It sounds like on a busy day that the sales director wouldn't have time to go to the bathroom.
Danny:Yeah, so exactly or have a lunch or right or actually just have a nice relaxed conversation with the resident that she moved in there the month before, and be able to walk the halls right and do these things or show up to the activities that's occurring. Middle of the day, we've also found and welcome home did a great job at this that most call or inquiries happen actually in the middle of in the afternoon. you think maybe it's when people are driving home from working or at night getting on their laptops, or maybe it's a to do list thing in the 1st of the morning, but it apparently. It's more that folks do their inquiries during, lunch to I think about 3 or 4 p. m. So it's really important. That's also when a lot of things happen for in the community. you're between lunch and your dinner hour and maybe you have scheduled tours because that's when most people like to tour. So how do you tour and answer your phones? And nurture a lead over, a three day workflow where you're actually doing multiple phone calls, you're texting and you're emailing to try to reach that family to get to move them to, to touring, whether they need to move now or a year from now, it's important that they tour. I always say that to always have said no one moves without touring. So you've got to get these families to move from inquiry to touring. And that's really what I think we do well here. Okay.
Erin:Sounds like it and then, for me, just to, to wrap my mind around being able to provide, remote sales director service to a community. that is shocking to me that a company can do that. And I didn't even know that was available and for executive directors or for companies that don't have that sales director and is feeling like, what am I going to do? Because I can't do it. All there is an opportunity to have that kind of support, which. could have come in handy at times for my career, whenever I was the sales director and the memory care program director at the same time, or the sales director and the, director of nursing, in quotation marks, when I didn't have those managers. The business has come a long way and being able to offer remote support. I would have never thought that was possible a couple years ago.
Danny:it gets back to the leads being different. I think, The fact that leads come in now, 90, I'd say I'm using minor percentages, but 99 percent of the leads come in via all those ways mentioned the websites, the chat bots, the aggregators. any of those types of or Google, right? They're going to the Internet and they're searching and going calling the community directly. and so forth. All of that allows for a remote salesperson to actually manage all those inquiries for the community successfully probably could have done that 20 years ago. Because they didn't come in that way. But now that they do. You can really have a remote salesperson to manage those leads and they speed to lead timely fashion that will get the results for that community. And they don't have that setback. They continue to build and maintain their pipeline of leads. And they're also booking tours that hopefully the executive director, the activities director, and so forth. Can go ahead and continue forward with, we have a client where they have a moving coordinator in any D, but they're down a sales director and they don't want to rush to hire. They really want to take their time, find the right person, the right fit and having us in the middle of that working all those leads mentioned and doing that all again speed to lead. We answer our calls within seconds. So that's we're not talking hours here. and so we're doing the outbound work called in and outbound. Okay. outbound being those aggregator leads and form fills getting to those within the first hour and calling on those families. and with that families become really fatigued after the third or fourth call or the third or fourth community. If they've gone through a third party service and that their information has been shared with five or six communities, you really want to be number one, two or three because people get very fatigued and they're also not going to tour six communities in most instances. You're probably going to tour two to three. And so you want to be one of those two or three if you want a real shot and value out of that lead that you've received from your partner, your partnership. We're there to do that and we can do that if you're down a sales director. You don't have to miss those opportunities because you call back a day later. Or you call back even hours later. We also have found most of most inquiries schedule tours in their first day. We've also found that it's really within the 1st hour that 70 percent of the reach and scheduling of a tour happens within that 1st hour. if you're an operator, and you don't have this solved for. You really need someone like us or a service like this to support that because and it can be done very cost effectively. Whether you do have a sales director that needs the additional support for all those reasons mentioned, you're down a sales director, and we can fill that gap for you for whatever period of time you need. You've got people on extended absences. We can support that. And then finally, what reason we call ourselves a call center and lead management solution is that we also work within. Databases that are, hundreds big or sized and years old, and we will go in and work in those and clean them up. We do those kind of special projects for our existing clients usually who want us to come in and they'll tack those on to our contact center services. So we are able to do a lot, right? Besides just answer your phones. But answering your phones correctly is the number one most important thing that if anyone could take anything out of this, make sure you're answering your calls correctly, right? And you're answering them in the way you want them answered, and that it's a true representation of your brand. That's something that we talk about a lot. You really want that to be the same across the country or across the region that if they call one community in Georgia, and they call the next community in, Michigan that they have a great experience across that brand. That's really important. Again, a service like us, we can solve for that for the community.
Erin:Absolutely. most of my community story has been turning. Troubled communities around and 1 part of turning a troubled community around is all the past dues inside of the database, which is time consuming. And I've had. Some really good sales and marketing directors. And I know that there'll be a great sales and marketing director when I tell them, I want you to call every single person in your database, because when you do that, you know what you're working with and, she didn't like me for the first 30 days, but she, but, but she was great after that. And it was because she knew what she was working with. and if you don't know what you're working with, you're, you're never going to know you're never going to get ahead. Because there is gold in the cold and you have an opportunity to introduce yourself. There is value in this call and in sales directors need to know that it is not a waste of time. It is a lot of time, but getting to know your database is very important. Now, just a caveat, I'm in an area in Mobile, in Alabama, that is. Not very metropolitan, right? So there wasn't we didn't have a huge database that was going to take her a very long time, but it was enough time that she would be Look at me and be like, you're crazy. I'll be like, I know, but it's worth it. so database management is very important.
Danny:and nurturing leads, right? nurturing them all leads are not the same and there are leads that need that 3 day call and the family's ready to go. They're ready to tour. They're ready to deposit. And that's all great. But a lot of people are in the beginning phases of this. They're in the research phase, or they've coming off of the hills of equipment. Crisis and they just started this, but now it's cooled off and it's slowing down. That does not mean that's not going to be your potential resident one day, right? Or your future resident. And again, back to the sales director. They're so busy and we're asking so much of them and we all know it and to ask them to go back and work on a lead or on a sales cycle that looks like 1 2 years. come on, right? That's a lot to ask of someone who's trying again every day, just resetting and restarting and getting through those leads and maybe getting to day 2 and day 3, but to go through 1 year and manage through that. And there's a special art to managing leads that are moving at that pace, not calling on a cadence of maybe every 3 months. that reduces down to every month or, in reaching those families that are at the time, I've always heard this in my career. Every time people go, I am so glad you called. Yeah, and these are leads that we've been calling on again for 2 years, but it's a matter. It is an art to it. You don't want to be aggressive. You want to be consistent. You want to be polite and you want to be sincere and your follow up. And there, this is where tech comes in. Marketing automation is very helpful. texting and then, randomizing that is really great to write, making, putting that on a on every other type thing. but this is where we're different, I think, than we were in the past. But again, nothing is valuable. I think is that phone call that says we're here. We're still checking on you. No pressure. But if you're ready, whenever you're ready, we're ready to have you back to visit. We're ready to have you come have lunch. Here's an activity that might interest you. Having that voice to voice is really important at any point in the lead journey.
Erin:Absolutely. You heard it from an expert, a lead expert. So thank you for your time today. I hope that we educated people on options for overwhelm. Right options for vacancies and options in. And then understanding of where leads come from. And even then, even in the community, I never called a place for mom or carrying dot com or care patrol or all these other places aggregators. That is a word that the industry as a whole uses. and all of those are aggregators. so if you didn't know that, now you do. That is an industry term, so thank you for your time and your expertise. I appreciate it. And again, Lee Genie is the call center and contact center that Danny is the CEO of. Again, thank you. Appreciate your time. And as always for my listeners, Aspire for more for you.